adding m4 feed ramps to barrel
This can lead to a rare but odd situation; barrel and receiver mismatch. AR15 20 inch Upper Receiver Group (SS) w/ Handguard | BCM Home Firearms Figuring Out Feed Ramps. I have seen it done many, MANY times and if done right, it works/functions 100% without issue. Feed ramps on barrel extensions are a good example. . You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers. Go slow and you'll be done in no time. That's an important thing since without the feed ramps, issues can arise when receivers and barrel extensions are mismatched. The M4 Style Feed ramps And Barrel Extension Provide Consistent Feeding And The Matte Black Manganese Phosphate Finish resists External Corrosion And OxidationLength: 14.70"Model: AR-15Finish: Manganese PhosphateBarrel Type: Carbine LengthBarrel Features: Chrome-LinedManufacturer: FN Mfg Number: 20-100405Model: AR-15 . I'm a machinist in the aerospace industry and lucky enough to have unrestricted access to a really nice machine shop so the modification from rifle to M4 feed ramps is no sweat, I've done it once before a few years back with a .250" carbide cutter in the mill for a friend and it came out looking indistinguishable from a true M4 extension. M4 Feedramps - AR-15 Pro Konza Defender M-LOK 5.56 16" Rifle 1x7 FEATURES: 16" 4150 Nitride 1x7 5.56 Barrel T-Marked Upper with M4 Feed Ramps Steel Micro Gas Block, and Carbine Length Gas Tube 15" 7075 T6 Aluminum Free Float M-LOK Hand Guard A2 Muzzle Break BCG is an M16 Style Nitride QPQ Finish Charging Handle Mil-Spec 6 Position Mil-Spec Diameter Stock Get The Best Trigger Pull Gauges To Make Every Shot Count. Reach in through the ejection port and slide the on deck cartridge about 1/4 inch forward and observe the tip of the bullet in relationship to the barrel extension. They . The difference between standard feed ramps and M4 ramps is easy to see. It may not display this or other websites correctly. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. I will check with compass lake. This USGI modification was done to both the barrel extension and the upper receiver, creating a longer and steeper feed ramp. The magazine lips cannot move, so with these larger diameter cartridges, the bullet tips down lower about the centerline of the bore (half of the diameter increase to be exact). The Differences Between an M4 and an AR15 - Music Raiser Your discussions, feedback and comments are welcome here as long as they are relevant and insightful. Some gun owners believe that the M4 ramps can help for some of the larger-diameter cartridges in use. We're a little past that point as I already own both the barrel and receiver, both of which cant easily be replaced or swapped for a decent price. FN AR-15 5.56X45mm Nato . In general, all you need to understand is that the M4 feed ramps include the barrel extension and upper receiver. So like ORD says it is entirely 100% possible and plenty of people do it, but I would rather not do any work to this perfect barrel. I'd rather just pay the gunsmith to make it work than hunt down another barrel/upper if possible. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. FN AR-15 5.56 NATO 20" Hammer Forged Barrel - Black What Are M4 Feed Ramps and What Is The Benefit Of It? - Adventure Footstep Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. "C" stamp and CAGE code available. Would not feed to save its life! Factory said its fine . Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. I think you will find that the tip of the bullet clears the M4 cuts in the upper receiver by a wide margin. I read in Bravo company that there are 2 kinds of flat top upper. DoubleStar M4 clone opinions | Survivalist Forum Upper Receiver, A4, Flat Top, USGI, Numbered, AR-Stoner Upper Receiver Stripped AR-15 A3 Flat-Top Matte, Black River Tactical 16 Cold Hammer Forged Optimum Barrel Accuracy Evaluation. In military situations, it is advantageous for rifles to function with damaged, worn, or less than ideally serviceable magazines. I notice that's a Gibbz (or Gibbz-type) upper. 2. Can I use a barrel with M4 feed ramps with an upper that isnt M4 matched? A couple of times I ended up with the OK set up from the picture above. In short, if you have a Dremmel you can do it yourself. Upload or insert images from URL. Being a Newbie AR owner ((Ive been an avid gun owner for nearly 50 years), I appreciate the information and visual aids that Im sure will be a big help in enjoying and using this gun platform. Bear Creek Arsenal Barrels - 6.5 Grendel Type 2 Barrel This Gorilla Machining AR-15 16" heavy Black Nitride 6.5 Grendel barrel has a Carbine length gas system with a 1:8 twist. If it was some flat top + 16" FSB barrel id just swap upper/barrel, but this is a little more challenging to do that with. I'm a machinist in the aerospace industry and lucky enough to have. All this basically means is that the ramps continue from the barrel extension down through the upper receiver tonthe magazine. I am having a tough time finding an in-stock barrel (18 or 20 incher) with a rifle extension on it. Earlfillmore 13 hr. There's no downside to having M4 feedramps on your carbine, but they are not as necessary without full auto and when using followers that will not tilt (or in a 20 AR15). M4 Feed ramps on barrel extensions are a solid example. Seems like it should work to me, but be a real challenge to keep clean and be damned ugly to boot. A4 Complete Upper Receiver - 7075 Forged A4 Flat Top Upper Receiver - M4 Feed Ramps Includes: - Add to Cart. /r/ar15 is here for your favorite black gun links, build pics, questions and other tactical or practical information. Please allow 5~10 days for assembly and testing before ship date. I will attest that a rifle upper and a barrel with the M4 feedramps works just fine. A couple of times I ended up with the OK set up from the picture above. You can run M4 cut barrels with rifle receivers, but not the other way around as it will create at catch that can hang up the bullets. Here's some info from Randall Rauch aka www.ar15barrels.com, if your barrel extension has M4 ramps you should have an upper receiver also with the ramps. You absolutely do not want it the other way around however. . This includes M4 feed ramps, barrel nut, front sight tower and sight post, and -28 threads for a muzzle device. If your upper isn't showing signs of bullets rubbing on the aluminum under the barrel extension, you should be good with M4 ramps. By my estimates, the tip of the bullet first hits the barrel extension about 1/3 of the way up the respective feed ramp on the barrel extension. Thanks. No feed ramps. To measure just where the round makes impact on the feed ramps, I did not use any sort of micrometer to measure. They provide a lower, wider, and smoother entry for any round of ammo, whether its necessary or not. Press J to jump to the feed. On AR9's, I understand the distance between the Mag Follower and the Feed Ramp is a known complication in the design. I didnt think anything about it having M4 feed ramps. BrianEnos.com So, lets glide down these lines below to erase your misconceptions about them. Ideally both. Semi autos run slower than full autos. You need to match up barrels to receivers for optimum performance. Either way is good and both types work great with semi auto only guns. I too built a .458 SOCOM carbine . While this gun is a more of novelty build than a "serious use" AR, I intend to use good parts and want it to run as well as my other ARs. Rifle vs m4 feed ramps - AR15.COM For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Everything that you have on your side to make any weapons more reliable and work when it absolutely needs to is a plus. Featuring hand lapped 1/8 twist rate button rifling and M4 feed ramps barrel extensions, the 410 stainless barrel gives the shooter the best balance of weight and accuracy. In most cases the ramps only help during full auto mode while cycling at a high rate. M4-style barrel extension with Rifle-type upper - Rifle - Technical If you have a bolt that you would like to use you are welcome to ship it to us for accurate headspace. Making a non M4 feed ramp barrel work in an M4 feed ramp upper. i have an extra brand new M4 barrel extension ramp to replace a rifle ramp. pictures would help. I am glad to know that I need to look for changes in design and the differences in the A2 and A4 feed ramp / rails. I suggest you get a rifle receiver. Lol. For instance I was looking at the BCM upper receiver, and it said it had M4 feed ramps machined into the upper. Reliability is the main concern for me when I re-barrel this rifle. Figuring Out Feed Ramps | Feed Ramp Tips | The Shooter's Log The M4, and the CAR-15, before it have had similar problems like the ones you mentioned. It is milled out of 6061 T6. I found the article very informative. How long your barrel "lasts" depends on what your accuracy threshold is before you decide it is too bad to keep using. JavaScript is disabled. Feedramps, proper staking of castle nuts, forward assist (yep went there)S-happens seen it. I guess it depends on what your relationship to the necessary shop activities is. So, what is the difference between M4 feed ramps and regular ones? M4 ramps help in feeding in for carbine in full auto. Looking for a black stripped A1 upper with non m4 feed ramps (just realized the upper I have wont work with my barrel). ago KrinkyDink2 9 hr. PRI MK 12 Mod H 16" 223/5.56 Upper w/ 1-7 twist Higher pressure equte to parts (bcg, buffer, buffer spring, ROUNDS, etc) experiencing much higher wear/tear. Not saying a really good gunsmith cant do it, just that theres a bit of an involved process. The best case is to have both an upper and barrel that have the feed ramps. Should M4 feed ramps come with the barrel or upper? : r/ar15 - reddit If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Feed Ramps -300BlkTalk BCM 14.5" MK2 Upper (Standard) w/ 13" MLOK Handguard - FDE The Mission of Cheaper Than Dirt! Which Model Colt 1911 is For Me? Supposedly you'll only notice issues with rapid/auto fire with a configuration like this. They offer a lower, more extensive, and smoother entry for any round of ammo, whether its necessary or not. All uppers are assembled cleaned and tested before shipping. M4 Barrel Extension (M4 Feedramps) - Bravo Company USA Its fine to use an M4 Barrel with a non-N4 (rifle) upper but if you have the barrel already is much simpler to just buy a M-4 upper and just replace the upper the barrel is harder to build..I have even cut ramps on a rifle upper and it really wasent needed That is before I knew better.Then I guncoted the ramps before I found out about Aluminum Black treatment. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win. Its easier to add feed ramps to the receiver not so easy to add them to the barrel extension. The M4 receiver feed ramps are cut at a steeper angle and, as a result, extend down into the receiver wall. The information provided here does not represent the views of Cheaper Than Dirt! By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. So, what youre saying is that an M16 upper (not M4 cut) will work with either barrel, but an M4 cut upper will only work with an M4 cut barrel. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win. Modify AR15 A2 barrel extension for M4 feed ramp? You are using an out of date browser. M4 can better explain their benefit, although they help with more reliable feeding. If I have a rifle ramp upper and get the barrel later and coincidentally will have an m4 ramp. All NFA rules apply. Hasn't misfed yet, through initial break in up through 1k rounds, and that's mag length ammo. Thanks for explaining the feed ramp topic in a couple of different ways. Thats an important thing since without the feed ramps, issues can arise when receivers and barrel extensions are mismatched. I'd get jams from bullets hitting the back of the upper so I took a small round file and made the M4 ramps in the upper. By my estimates, the tip of the bullet first hits the barrel extension about 1/3 of the way up the respective feed ramp on the barrel extension. I can probably get the upper reciever first. An upper without feed ramps can be used with a barrel that has them as the majority of the ramp is on the barrel extension. M4 feed ramps were created during the development of the xM4 carbine for the original Army requirement of a carbine rifle that used the then current M16A2 upper receiver, 14.5" Barrel and had featured a collapsible sliding stock. Shorter length equates to much higher pressure in the upper receiver. The first reason is that they are, indeed, better. These Mil-Spec M4 feed ramps are part of the original CNC manufacturing process. You must log in or register to reply here. But, as with anything else, this work can go too far. I recommend putting any AR-platform firearm together with a matched M4 barrel extension and upper receiver set, just because you can. Does it make a big difference? I think my question would be why rifle receiver+M4 barrel is just "ok" rather than "good", unless the point is that in a carbine-gas gun M4 ramps are just considered an improvement over no ramps. The only one I found is LaRue's upper, but it won't work with the hand guard I'm using (Geissele MKIII). Watch a video about our Modern Series AR barrel: The angle is going to be key, alot of people attempt to mimic the angle of the barrel feed ramps, this is incorrect. The ramp angles are different and changing the profile of the extension doesn't make it something it isn't. All Rights Reserved. Since the M4 barrel is one and a half inches shorter than the minimum legal barrel you can install in an AR15, the M4 gas tube will be, of course, smaller. Id just get one for that barrel and find a barrel with m4 extension for the upper you already have. Do you need an M4 feed ramp on your AR? Here is some info. I've seen several places say you just need a 1/8" chainsaw sharpening bit and a Dremel to fix it. The barrel is supposed to have the M4 feed ramps. Moreover, telling someone that an extension can be modified, while not a lie, is nothing more than mental masturbation when your post contains a caveat for having the knowledge and proper tools. I like getting another Upper idea then you could end up with two rifles! Thanks! Ballistic Performance of Federal Punch .22 LR Ammunition with the Heritage Barkeep #1063. Those ramps line up with the barrel, which are cut deeper than on a rifle barrel. It has ran flawlessly (barring tuning of the gasblock when new) with several different brands of magazines and ammo. The parts are interchangeable. Both. I'll probably build a pistol out of this one. Machined from 4150 Chrome Moly Vanadium Steel and feature a QPQ corrosion resistant finish and QPQ coated M4 feed ramp extension. Powered by Invision Community, M4-style barrel extension with Rifle-type upper. You also repeated yourself. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. Recommend using a gunsmith this route too if you are not comfortable. Powered by Invision Community. JavaScript is disabled. Its highly recommended to put any AR-platform firearm together with a matching M4 barrel extension and upper receiver set. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. Adding M4 feedramps to A1/C7 upper - M4Carbine.net However Ive built numerous ar15 and lr308 rifles and pistols. I like all my guns to be reliable. 30 cal. Thank you for answering the question do well. Caught a deal on a matched barrel and bolt. Somwhere in the 1990s I believe, Colt designed the M4 feed ramps, where they took some of the material out of the upper receiver, cut two little ramps in it and then cut the ramps in the barrel extention a little further forward. So the engineers lowered the feed rampa into the receiver. It's best to use rifle/rifle combo or M4/M4. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. True, which is why they're not even needed in semi autos. So I called. Sent back again. One of the AR15 engineers under Gene Stoner pretty much said that the M4 isn't a good platform, especially once the gas port erodes a bit. Ar15 Upper receivers A2 and Colt A1, M4 and - Northwest Firearms That is what I tell people when they try to convince me that they need a stainless barrel instead of chrome-moly. Also, barrel life is relative. As a result, the factory machined M4 feed ramps on the receiver are hard coat anodized which adds significant strength to the aluminum. With the bcg moving that much faster, the magazine springs were having a hard time supplying the rounds fast enough, AS WELL AS the tips of the rounds were digging into the feed ramps and catching. You can put a M4 barrel and non-M4 receiver together, but you can't mismatch them the other way. You cannot paste images directly. Additionally, in this increasingly specialized world of AR-15 parts that we live in, there are proprietary feed ramp cuts used for some alternate cartridges, such as .458 SOCOM. You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers. Barrel customizations are also available. Your previous content has been restored. The rifle receiver, doesn't have ramps on the receiver, they are only cut into the barrel. what does it do?? Remember less is more, little by little. can the barrel extension be bought individualy? By Yamil Sued August 6, 2021. Any body need a anchor for a very small boat? CARBON-15 Stripped Lower Receiver You can modify the upper, but bear in mind that the un-anodized aluminum surface will be very soft and prone to wear if your particular bullet hits it frequently. An older-version (or A2-style) feed ramp is cut only on the barrel extension itself (top). You can post now and register later. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. Douglas 5.56 Stainless Steel Barrel 18" - 1~7 twist 50 bucks one way or the other on the barrel ain't squat! In case My barrel is rifle ramp it won't be so bad after all. However, an M4 barrel extension is dished more so the feed ramps could extend downward, and then an area within the upper is shaped to match. For this test, I used a Colt upper with M4 feed ramps and a SOCOM heavy 14.5 barrel, just like what is used in the military. If this is your first visit, be sure to The barrel Throat is the second most critical component after angles and should be polished with utmost care. 5. The good idea is that the round, presented at a lower plane, will contact other lower feed ramps and go right on in. 's blog. Rear side of a CZ-75B pistol barrel showing the (here dirty) feed ramp. Should not be too hard. I picked up a side charging upper from Sundevil last year. Some, me included, have said that the M4 ramps are a help to some of the larger-diameter cartridges in use, such as 6.5 Grendel or .22 Nosler. I don't quite trust myself to give it a go, but if that's all there is to it I'm hoping they can do it for a reasonable price. PSA PA-15 16"M4 Phosphate 5.56 NATO 1/7 Classic AR-15 Rifle with 13.5"M Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and saturday appointments available. The M4 style feed ramps and barrel extension provide consistent feeding and the matte black Manganese Phosphate finish resists external corrosion and oxidation. P2A PATRIOT 22" 223 Wylde 1/7 Rifle Length Melonite Fluted Heavy Bull The barrel blanks available are made from 416 Stainless Steel. The M4 cut extends down beyond the edge of the barrel extension (has a scalloped appearance), and a correspondingly deeper cut in an M4-spec upper receiver effectively extends the ramps downward (they're lowered). Modern Series Barrels. Editors Note: This article was originally published in January of 2019. The last is using the best and right ammo for the job. However, they do have M4 feed-ramps which is not clone correct. An upper without feed ramps can be used with a barrel that has them as the majority of the ramp is on the barrel extension. BEFORE YOU GO MODIFYING IT, check your headspace.I have a Gibbz upper in my junk drawer because the upper -- for some reason -- wouldn't allow a perfectly good bolt (as checked by Criterion) to headspace correctly on a Criterion barrel, with the bolt installed in the carrier. I have a non ramped barrel in a ramped upper, feeds fine. Again, youll find plenty of videos on spooling up hand grinders to remedy feed ramp and ejection port issues with these larger cartridges, but I strongly suggest going factory-done aftermarket. I'd get jams from bullets hitting the back of the upper so I took a small round file and made the M4 ramps in the upper. You can always buy a non-m4 extension and have the new barrel retimed and headspaced, but it will probably cost more than a new upper receiver. After two months of back and forth, cleaned up the feed ramps. No Feed Ramps on upper? - General Discussion - 308AR.com Community Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited. Avoid Polishing Too Lightly Or Too Roughly Read Now. VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. This is one time it's better to go a little too far than to leave an edge for the . You have the option of barrel type, thread, fluting, finish type and to add a match bolt. Ok, So, in short, I've got a barrel on my Armalite upper (with M4 feed ramps in the upper) that has standard AR-15 (non-M4) ramps. 11.5", SBN, 1:7, 5.56 NATO Barrel I have done the same, protect the Barrel extension with a layer of electrical tape and carefully file or Dremel the ramps into the aluminum receiver. are all barrels w/ m4 feed ramps?? M4 M-4 Feed Ramp Jam with 55 gr grain Bullets, Solution, Fix, AR15 AR-15 Stuck Cartridge iowaunemployment 21K views 10 years ago Comparing AR15 barrels -Faxon vs. Bear Creek arsenal-. If your magazines are set up correctly, and the feed lip edges polished smooth, each round fed from the magazine will go directly into the chamber. Theres a bit more to it than just polishing. As they are becoming more and more a standard, and certainly do not do any harm to us. Then you can get a regular rifle barrel for the upper with no ramps. Is it kosher to add M4 feed ramps to a standard upper to match an m4 ramped barrel? Forged 7075-T6 aluminum is harder than a bulls balls. Amazing what happens in a thread over a simple question. Don't ever put non M4 ramped barrel on a M4 ramped upper receiver. Now move move the on deck cartridge forward to the 3/8 of inch position and again note the position of the tip of the bullet in relationship to the barrel extension. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. You will be able to leave a comment after signing in, AR15Armory.com If a barrel comes with the feed ramps could I take them off? I've seen uppers with and without anodizing on M4 ramps . it seems to me to be about 50/50 with and without. . Gun smith said , not head spaced properly. Bullets tend to bump, snag, and stub on these guns. Installing a Luth-AR Rifle Buffer Tube and an A2 Stock #1041. BUT, I DO NOT TRUST MY LIFE TO THAT WEAPON. practical_man The upper is designed to have two levels of top rails for mounting of night vision in front of scopes. LanceRiley, Feed ramp - Wikipedia M4 feed ramps will extend the barrel extension and the upper receiver. Not all mil-spec features advertised on the product information are the real mil-specs. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. He had more to say and added some more engineer and gun designer speak too. Use this M4 Barrel extention with M4 feedramps. Absolutely nothing to do with casing diameter, or whatever other weird sht you guys imagine. The trust part is accepting claims of USGI-spec parts actually being done to not only blueprint dimensions, but also made from the correct materials treated to the same processes. I got my help from this thread, and thank you again to ORD. There are now thousands of upper receivers and ready-to-use barrels that have the cuts of M4 feed ramps. The manufacturer said they had sold hundreds of barrels with out problems reported. I've shot a good deal of rounds through 20" A2's and I realize they run but you are describing issues that the M4 feed ramps alleviate, that would probably be good to reduce on A2's as well. I think you will find that the tip of the bullet clears the M4 cuts in the upper receiver by a wide margin. AR-15 Feed Ramp Problems - School of the American Rifle I didn't forsee that we'd ever see the day when replacement parts would be so hard to get. Description Genuine 14.5" SOCOM, carbine length gas system barrel from Colt. This 20" BCM barrel is machined from SS410 stainless steel. Please be respectful of others. Backing up a ton: The ramps on regular barrel extension are cut just to the edges, while the M4 feed ramps have deeper cuts in the M4-spec upper receiver. For someone who is new at trying to understand feed ramps it helps to read a couple different explanations. Jams and misfires. Colt LE6920SOCOM M4 Carbine 5.56 16.1 Barrel SOCOM Sight 30-rd and add them to non-m4 barrels.? Having been in military supply, I know that what the mil-spec means: it gets the minimum job done for thousands (millions) of parts/systems. Full M4 feed ramps are on both the upper and barrel extension.
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